Rebecca Roberts 0:02
Hello, you're listening to Ruth and
Ruth Dale 0:03
I'm your host at behaviour change Marketing Bootcamp podcast. In today's episode, we meet Rebecca Roberts, Rebecca and I chat and ask each other questions about each other, in an effort to get to know each other. Why are we getting to know each other? Because we are plotting behind the scenes to bring you something very, very special for 2020. Now, Rebecca is a complete pro at marketing and comms in youth, young adult sports higher ed further, her career is incredible. She will share all of that with you in the episode. And I really hope you enjoy this different style. It's very relaxed. And then we reveal all at the end of the episode. So please hang on in there, please listen all the way through, see what the news is. And let us know what you think. And as always, please do share with your friends and your reviews, your reviews mean everything. But thank you so much for listening. I hope you enjoy.
Ruth Dale 1:01
Hello, we are delighted to welcome into the studio today. Rebecca Roberts. Rebecca robbers is an expert in marketing and youth education, higher education, further education. And we've got some exciting news together. So we thought we would want to announce our news to you, but to perhaps do a different style of interview where we interview each other, just as a way of introducing each other as a way of kind of explaining to where we're coming from and why we're doing what we're doing. So does that make sense? Rebecca? Is that what we discussed?
Rebecca Roberts 1:35
I think that's pretty much what we discussed. Yeah. Exciting news. And then just a good old chat.
Ruth Dale 1:40
So shall we leave the exciting news to the end? Yeah.
Rebecca Roberts 1:44
Oh, gosh, like what a cliffhanger. Sorry, everyone.
Ruth Dale 1:48
Yeah, let's just hope everyone thinks it's as much of a cliffhanger. So we've got a joint gig coming up, which we're going to offer you which we will explain more at the end. But we've kind of brought our worlds together. There's a lot of synergy and a lot of overlap. So we've decided to do something together for everyone to help them in their marketing. But before we go down that road, we've got what is it five or six questions, that we're just going to ask each other in order to really break down some barriers for everyone, because I know everyone listens to my podcast that they all know me, but they probably don't know, Rebecca, and Rebecca is gonna air this on her podcast. And of course, her guys don't know me. So to get us started, Rebecca, who was Rebecca when she was 16 years old,
Rebecca Roberts 2:38
I was yeah, a challenging teen I think. And now I have a preteen as well. So that's all fun. And I wouldn't say challenging as in like a real rebel. But I think a lot of the things so my background is like working in sport and higher ed, as you said them worked with a lot with kind of sports charities now in youth charities, and that kind of thing, and really passionate about engaging youth, young audiences. And I think a key thing for me, a lot of things dropped off as I got to that kind of teenage things like hobbies, sport, all those kinds of things. You know, puberty is a real challenge for Teen Girls, I think with that type of thing around identity. And yes, share my age, we didn't have social media. But I think the influences of kind of pop culture magazines, and that kind of comparison, the thief of joy thing, we all we all go through. I kind of see that a lot in kind of today and how young people kind of are challenged with that in terms of social media and kind of maintain their identity as they kind of go into sort of teen hood. So yeah, I was kind of a Mardi teen, and dropped off my my, my dreams of being a pianist and a ballerina for probably boyfriends and trying to look grown up and go out and pretend I was 18 is probably what my main thing is. What about you?
Ruth Dale 3:48
I was just gonna use the exact same phrase. So we haven't pre prep these questions at all. I was gonna say I was a nightmare. And I feel like well, I have actually apologised to my dad. Now I have a 15 year old I'm like, oh, goodness me I had no appreciation of the pain of parenthood and the worry and the stress. I loved hockey I was I was quite active at our local nightclub called Esquires so you would probably find me in there when I shouldn't have been but it was like rock music and goth music. And all I ever wanted to do was go to Camden Market and get my leather jacket which I did. And then draw on it you know paint on it and everything like that. But ya know, I was a happy 16 year old generally but I probably a little bit rebellious but nothing that exciting. But when I do look back I do think oh my god, my poor pair. Yeah. That really wasn't into my education. Yeah,
Rebecca Roberts 4:50
that kind of came a bit later but that kind of whole thing about selfish teens. I think that's just like par for the course. It's just like part of growing up but yeah, difficult to parent and difficult to kind of I guess, engage ethically from a marketing perspective? Yes,
Ruth Dale 5:04
yeah. Well, it's experience you would never put on your CV, but it's definitely grounding us for working with higher ed. And further Ed, I would say. So, sort of jumping forward to now, what has your experience in marketing in sort of higher ed been and why thread and fable tell me how that was born? Yeah. So
Rebecca Roberts 5:24
I worked in mainly performance sports, marketing and comms and PR role.
Rebecca Roberts 5:29
I worked for British volleyball, I worked at West Brom football club and premiership football. And then I did about seven or eight years at the English Institute of Sport, which they look after all the sports science and medicine for elite athletes. I did three Olympic cycles so a really great experience. And we did quite a lot of what we started to do more kind of marketing to students wanting to progress their career. So that was like my first sort of taste of kind of like an educational product, and loved that. And then a job came up at Keele University, 32 years as deputy director of marketing, student communication and recruitment there, which is great and really good experience. And it's quite like like Groundhog Day, you kind of recruit your students and then it's like, it's like the scence from Elf ! "Yeah, Christmas is a great success. Let's prepare for next Christmas". Because the cycle is like very constant.
Rebecca Roberts 6:23
I worked with a lot of different agencies and I guess the frustration for me was you'd get these massive agencies that the pitch was amazing. And then the delivery was always like, whoever could be bothered, and you'd end up doing so much of it yourself. And I felt that I could offer something as Thread & Fable with the network, I had of practitioners and freelancers to do something a bit different. So yeah, I set up in 2017. And yeah, work cross bought higher education and quality colleges as well. And national education campaigns, and then quite a lot of stuff like the NHS and a lot of charities in youth charities. So yeah, that's kind of me. But yeah, 20 years. Makes you feel horrendously old. What about you?
Ruth Dale 7:12
Wow. Yeah. So how did I end up at boot camp? I think boot camp got me to be honest. It wasn't planned I did communications and sociology. And I went into publishing. So I worked for the big boys Capita, eMAP, the publishing houses. In informa, we had a really big public sector publications, wing, as it were, and then a big life sciences. So healthcare comes, and I worked there. And then I just thought, right, I'm gonna go and work for the NHS that just seemed to offer so much more for the skills. Publishing is quite repetitive, but in the sense that I just wanted to do a little bit more with marketing and wanted to work a bit closer with people. And so I went to work at London Hospital, which was amazing. And then I just kind of made my way round the NHS system into primary care, public health, public health, England. And I just got lucky because when behavioural science was born, I was just in the right place at the right time training was freely given everyone was expected in marketing to train up in it, can you believe it in public health, everyone was expected to train and those people going around the country training people.
Ruth Dale 8:22
And I just had really forward thinking Director of Public Health - I wasn't in the comms team in the sense when I was working at the hospital - this is how old I am Friday night was News of the World night! And so when I went to public health, I was really lucky. I wasn't in the response mode. I wasn't in press office, I wasn't managing a department. Suddenly, I was managing campaigns and managing audience insight, which I absolutely fell in love with. And behavioural science, for me just took it to a whole new level. But there weren't that many people who could deliver it at that point. So we used to do a lot in house and would work with like quite traditional market research agencies to develop it and a bit like yourself, I would end up doing a lot myself. And then I was being asked by other people could I do their market research and sorry, there's sort of behavioural deep dives. And when COVID hit and I was working in public health, England, I ended up doing so much training then. And I just carried it on because it just fell in love with the training. And I think over 20 years of delivering campaigns, I was like, Okay, this is okay to have a break from campaigns, focusing and share all of the learning and boot camps. Now going into its fourth year, we've had nearly 400 people through the doors in our team and our live sessions. So yeah, it's been amazing. It's been amazing, really happy and it was completely unplanned. As you can probably tell from when you go back to the early days, we were just sitting on Eventbrite and now we've got a dedicated site and everything. So in a nutshell, that's me.
Ruth Dale 9:56
I we've got a bit of a detour question for you now, Rebecca. What is your favourite Netflix series?
Rebecca Roberts 10:01
I saw this just now I was like, I'm so random eclectic. So I like Stranger Things, which is an odd one because I really hate like horror and gore. Like I hate scary stuff. It's not my thing, but I like kind of like that and watch it. I'm trying to think of stuff I watched I watched a second documentary on Netflix, which is a bit random. I quite like those. And I've got a Robert William one's one at the moment. I think living in Stoke on Trent that's been quite fun to watch that. A bit of a flashback to my 90. I like Lupin the thirller. I quite like that kind of stuff.
Rebecca Roberts 10:01
Murder Mystery. Yeah. Wow. Just going to David Beckham. Did you see all the gif that came out? When the Netflix was released? Everyone's going 'he cleans as well!"
Rebecca Roberts 10:30
I find it really fun. I liked it was quite an interesting dynamic to see kind of their relationships. I thought they came across quite as pretty nice. I thought. There's quite some funny stuff. And I saw her the other day she's released a t shirt that said, my dad drove me to school in a Rolls Royce. Because there's that scene where she said, you know, as a working class, like He's creeping the door saying, What car did your dad drive?
Rebecca Roberts 11:14
So I thought it was quite funny. Like, yeah, it was just a bit different. What kind of stuff? Do you like watching?
Ruth Dale 11:20
Oh, God, I'm embarrassing. If you turned on Netflix now and looked at my channel, it's selling the OC or selling sunset? I'm addicted. I'm addicted.
Rebecca Roberts 11:33
I've not I've not yet seen is it worth? Is it one of those guilty pleasure things?
Ruth Dale 11:37
It really is. So it's the kind of thing you can have on in the background, you will get dragged in. Or what I'm saying is you will think oh, yeah, half an hour. 40 minutes. I mean, you'll be there three hours later, wondering what has happened to your life? What's happened to your brain? Why is it so good? And then with your comms hat on? You're like, yeah, why is this so good? Yeah, I have to admit, I do watch it with my son. He's 15. So he absolutely finds it hilarious. But it's the houses is the like, I did not know people live like that.
Rebecca Roberts 12:15
Now I need to have a little look. So that mine too serious and full of murder? And yeah.
Ruth Dale 12:21
Yeah, it's either that absolute rubbish or anything with vampires in it, which is another guilty pleasure. I know. So when I watch TV, I just want to switch off from reality, I think working in the healthcare and the politics that surrounds healthcare. And literally, when you're managing press office, you just see your job on the news 24/7. And mostly, it will really annoy you because it's been misrepresented. So I'm like, I have to have something that has absolutely nothing to do with real life. If I'm having some downtime, which I guess they know, I'm I guess I'm one of many, because it's so popular.
Rebecca Roberts 12:56
People want a complete distraction from reality.
Ruth Dale 13:06
So we can get answer two tips. What one tip, would you tell Rebecca from 10 years ago? S
Rebecca Roberts 13:14
I've got two kids that are 12 and 10. So I just had my second. And I think it'd be just to believe that you can just still go for stuff and change your career and not worry about that kind of stuff. Because I think taking a leap to work for myself seven years ago, almost felt huge, but actually, it really wasn't. And I should just Yeah, so the year ago, I'll probably still take say things like back myself more, and just kind of Yeah, just believe that it will all work out. What about you? What would you say to yourself? 10 years ago?
Ruth Dale 13:50
That was lovely. So nice. I think you're right, though. Just any females getting out there after babies? You have to believe in yourself? Yeah, what would I say to myself 10 years ago? Oh my gosh, how old was Henry Henry was two I was really tired.
Ruth Dale 14:06
I probably say just be really kind and nicer to yourself. And like you do not worry. Worry is wasted energy. I think I worried about everything. George would have been starting schools I would have been worried about that. Henry would have been in childcare. So I would have been worried about that work deadlines. I think that's just one big worry ball of worry. And I probably would have said put self care first it's like pouring from an empty cup. As a working mom, that's really true.
Rebecca Roberts 14:36
You're expected to work like you don't have a child and your expected to parent as though you don't have work. And that juggle, I think guilt constantly like am I doing enough here? Am I doing enough there? And I think I became quite an unapologetic to the point actually I had a verbal disagreement with someone in the meeting a woman who didn't have children and said, I don't think it's appropriate or you bring up your kids in a meeting. And I said, it's really funny because the two senior men are on the table. You didn't say that too. And she went really red and said Oh, my God, I didn't, did I? And I was like, No, I actually joined in their conversation, because they were talking about the birth of their second child. And she was like, Oh, my God. Yeah.
Rebecca Roberts 15:19
And I was like, You know what, I'm going to make a point of doing it more often. Because it's part of me. And I think it's really, sometimes as a woman, and you can take on a senior role you feel that you can't talk about that was unprofessional. And I think actually, you know, double down be yourself, because it's, you know, you can bring yourself to work, not all of it. Sometimes you just want to get on really, really tired I've not slept. But I think that that identity crisis, you kind of have where you're kind of not sure what to be where I think you just Yeah, forget all that and be kind to yourself. Yeah,
Ruth Dale 15:50
no, you're so right, though. It's like giving yourself a sense of permission to be yourself. Because you have changed your identity has changed - " your're a mim". But you are expected almost all we do it to ourselves, we keep our old identity. So when you put your work clothes on, then it's old, me that goes to work, but my brain is going well, actually, old, you. You might have been tired from a hangover. You're not tired from three weeks no sleep, completely different. Yeah. But also, I think, like I say, I think it can add value. I think COVID really broke down the barriers a lot and brought the home life and made people a lot more real and a lot more rounded.
Ruth Dale 16:29
And I think when I had George was when I first looked at my career and looked what I was doing. And I was like, What am I doing, I have this huge responsibility. And I wanted more. And suddenly, I was probably more focused, and I was so desperate to go and get him off to childcare. I pretty much did more. I think during that day, you know, to not be late, my boundaries with meetings were higher. I'd be like, no, no, yes, you know, focus, focus, probably a bit boring, you know, in the sense that not as chatty and things, but I really was laser focused in order to one move for my development, so I could support him, but also just get out of there on time, you know, in their first little, and then when Henry came along, I was the opposite of I asked to stay for another half an hour, because when I get home, I'm not gonna get a cup of tea.
Unknown Speaker 17:20
We've all been there.
Ruth Dale 17:22
So what one tip, would you tell Rebecca from 20 years?
Rebecca Roberts 17:31
I was I was 21. I was at university. And I think, you know, I think when marketing comes and I kind of did some of this but like I didn't box myself in I felt really bad that I had a lot of friends are like young going into particular sectors and really knew what they wanted to do. And I still didn't really and my whole degree was like I did a Bachelor of Science in Management, because I wasn't 100% Sure which area of business I liked. I think with marketing, like keep your mind and your ideas open to what you might want to learn.
Rebecca Roberts 18:00
Because I think that's a useful skill in terms of marketing, comms moves really fast, like social media was just coming around 20 years ago. And we're just sort of like all making a decision to try out Facebook and all that kind of stuff. And or MSN, got some extra 100. But I think being open to learn skill. So when I manage, for example, I managed a digital team at one point in my career, and I knew about comps, but I wasn't ofay with a lot of the stuff they were doing. And I did like a coding course, like a free coding course from the Code Academy, which is excellent. Because when they were talking about stuff, not because I wanted to pretend I knew everything, but I just wanted to have some level of literacy to understand some of the problems they were talking about. And I and I was also did it to kind of take the mick out myself a little bit because I was like, it's so hard. And I think that being open to learning new things and trying new things, particularly Marcomms, I would have kind of said to myself 20 years ago, just continue to be open to that. And also not be afraid of other people being brilliant. Because again, that's the thing. And I say it when I've done mentoring before, like if you're managing people, like I love it when people are really great, and specialists are what they do, and it doesn't take away from you. But I think that in terms of your career, because at that time when people were like, you know, like you there's always got friends who just knew exactly what they want to do and exactly where they wanted to go. And I I still probably I kind of do but I'm just not that type of person. But that's okay for them. And I think just that kind of that comparison and just that that theme would be something that talked about as a long tip. Sorry. No,
Ruth Dale 19:29
that's really nice. Just be nicer to yourself. With for me, I oh my gosh, I did comms at uni communication, sociology. But I was surrounded by absolute geniuses. So in my journalism module, we had to read out our writing. Oh, I did not want to read after these guys because they were incredible. Absolutely incredible. And they've always wanted to be a journalist. They wanted to do journalism. And I kind of stumbled in there going oh, that sounds nice. And then a photography course you know, passionate people live and breathe it. That was where they lived in the darkroom. And again, I kind of stumbled in there and I realised I was like, oh, okay, everyone really has a huge passion for what they're doing. And they really want to focus and go there. And I was a bit in awe and then equally a little bit lost. So So oh, what do I want to do? Which is why I think, yeah, if I was gonna look back 20 years, I would I, the tip I don't have to give myself is to enjoy London, as I would not leave London, you could not pay me enough to get me out of London. I was, I loved London in my 20s. But I think the tip would be just to enjoy University more, just to actually, it's as much about understanding yourself and growing your life skills, and critical thinking. And actually, I would say that I kind of wish I'd had a break between school and uni, because I think I was so cognitively exhausted by the end of uni, kind of thought, That's it, I've had enough for learning. And the thought of doing any learning ever again, was horrific. Whereas actually, now you're older, you kind of know, it's a lifelong thing. And you really just got to get home with it, and not worry about, like you say, whether you're where you're coming in class is just about you. It's just about me. And when I think now like to higher ed and university students now their decisions they're making around whether they go to uni, they're so different to the ones I had to make, I just had to go through the clearing process, because it wasn't sure I didn't know where I was going. But their decision seems so much they seem more adult, I'm I don't think I would have been ready, it started to make such an adult decision.
Rebecca Roberts 21:45
It starts a lot earlier. There's a couple of things that have happened in hiring, like major things. So obviously, the cost of it. So now so much more expensive to perhaps when we were at uni, you know, a lot of universities are charging it up to 99,000 a year. And also coupled with the cost of living everything else, it is an expensive thing to do. So the barriers are there. And there is this real challenge where a degree alone won't necessarily stand you out, a lot of people can access or are going to get degrees. So it's finding the right degree, and there is a pressure, and it makes it slightly transactional uncomfortable that, you know, if I'm paying for this degree, it must then therefore equate to a job that is going to be worthwhile doing, which is true.
Rebecca Roberts 22:28
However, often that means that studying for the love of a subject is kind of traded off with how Career Ready is this degree? So there's that kind of value for money debate, which is ongoing, I think in higher ed. And yeah, I just think the decision making for university starts so much earlier, we're seeing younger and younger teens going off to open days to think about that. And I think that's pushed down, you know, the pressure exams, and that kind of whole decision path is kind of cemented at a much younger age, I think I was exposed to
Ruth Dale 22:59
Yes because we have the university come to the sort of year 11. So we had them come and talk, which I couldn't believe Oh, no, it's the sixth form thing. So down here in Devon, everyone chooses a sixth form. Yeah, which was very different. Where I grew up, you just carried on at your old school, everyone had a sixth form. But down here, not every school does, but some do. And there's big colleges, so they all kind of have to promote themselves almost. So you get the child to choose. And then I'm all of a sudden, very involved, which I was reflecting back on, my parents wouldn't have been involved in my decision as much. Whereas I'm hovering as a decision maker going, God, you're gonna come out with this much debt, you have to really want this. And so suddenly, the college choice of college is equally as important because that feeds into the uni decision. Yeah, it's,
Rebecca Roberts 23:49
it is massive. And I think, you know, I think students have a very tough time, there's loads of reports, I won't bore you with the latest stat. But for accommodation alone, there's a real mismatch with a number of people, young people needing student accommodation to what's available now. And the cost of that and the quality of that. So that's a particular challenge. And there's lots of things over the past couple years where students are getting places, particularly in clearing there was, you know, they haven't travel like miles, miles miles to actually get from their accommodation, you know, and harvest students last year, you know, cut back on food because of cost of living, you know, food. So it's just a new layer on intersectionality around your disability, race, socio economic background, and that's kind of heightened so I think it isn't easy. I think the thought of being a student previously was around, you know, it's great. You can do all these things. You're I remember working through uni to help financially, I was first and family to go to university as well. But I think a lot of that is, you know, even more challenging for a lot of students and those who are working are kind of trading off like can I afford to? Am I keeping up my subject? Am I doing everything I need to do so? Yeah, it's not necessarily the easiest choice. Yeah.
Ruth Dale 24:56
And it does kind of polarise the decision as well. Did I Make the right choice or the wrong choice, which then really stresses the decision even further, doesn't it? And I can see like, as a parent, you're looking at it quite differently to a child because or since a child, there you go my teenager or kill me young adult, because they are young adults. But as an adult, as a parent, you're thinking, Well, I understand the weight of that debt, there's no way you're gonna understand that, not because you can't just because that's a life experience thing. Yeah. And so you do automatically think, well, how are you going to pay it off? How are you going to start, especially when you think about the cost of houses, and you know, them having some sort of housing security? So yeah, as a parent, your your brain just starts going it spirals? And if you're working in marketing, and in higher ed, I can imagine, yeah, you need to know and understand all these decision points. Yeah. And
Rebecca Roberts 25:50
it's the offer of higher education. Interesting, I've just put out a podcast on my podcast, on the challenge of Fe marketing, because they're in a really sandwiched position between high school higher ed, and it's really like a challenging market, higher ed is still extremely challenging. And I think that the biggest, like challenge is making sure you're, you know, doing like sustainable approaches to kind of engaging students with the offer, and making sure that value for money is there and, and is a true reflection of what the university is offering. But yeah, it was an ever changing kind of cycle.
Rebecca Roberts 26:22
And I think sometimes you get very distracted with, you know, I talk about youth trends. But I also make sure that I talk about the context of what young people are experiencing, there is a lot out there, like, Hey, check this trend on it. And these trends, and that is always important. But it isn't as important as thinking about the it's the biggest decision that young persons made, it's probably the first big decision they've ever made in their life. And, you know, it's like, it's akin to buying a house, do you look around, you get a feel for a place and you think, is this right for me kind of thing? We're universities exactly like that, because you're looking around, you're thinking, Can I imagine myself here? No alumni marketing has a really big role to play in thinking, what is that career? Get a lead somewhere? But, you know, really, and I guess, you know, people will kind of relate to this, but for a lot of shooting marketing is can that young person, imagine them being at that institution? You know, we would get inquiries like what the curtains like in this hall? What do I What the, what's the food, like, because they're trying to visualise their life there. They are maybe thinking of a few years down the line, but some won't be some, you know, so that whole emotional decision, and with big parental influences, who often may be supportive financially, is actually quite complex. And also, we go back to the whole first thing that not all young adults are the same. So yeah, yeah,
Ruth Dale 27:42
exactly. Yeah. And what's the new generation called generation?
Rebecca Roberts 27:46
So that's kind of like, I dislike the iPad generation, kind of 2010 onwards, besides my daughter's kind of and below, and, you know, they're sort of getting into teens now. So they're, they're already now facing that whole thing, where they're getting colleges and universities visiting them. There'll be outreach programmes from universities, they might have experience. So, you know, for higher ed marketers, they need to be thinking about that generation coming up, as well as Gen Z, obviously, as a kind of mature. Yeah,
Ruth Dale 28:14
exciting. So this kind of leads us really nicely on to what's happening. Do you want to say join me to say you have to say, are you going for it? We're so planned? Well, as you just heard, everything Rebecca just said, um, something your audience is absolutely critical for higher ed and FE marketing. And so we have come together to design a one day boot camp day. So we have a higher ed and I should say, further ed, and higher ed boot camp special 29th of February, it's one whole day, looking at how we can use behavioural science to understand audiences, but also tackle the key challenges that are being faced now. So I'm bringing the behavioural science and Rebecca is bringing the higher and Effie sort of perspective. And together, we will sort of dedicate the day for workshops, as always, but you will nail behavioural science. So we absolutely promise that within the first workshop, you will have mind blown penny drop moments in ways to understand your audience. And then we're going to deep dive on actually on generation alpha, aren't we? Yeah, Rebecca is going to lead that and Rebecca is going to bring all of the updates on these youth trends, which will be fantastic. And then we'll actually spend the afternoon looking at applying behavioural science, applying the behavioural biases, which you probably see a lot on LinkedIn, but you can use them wrong. You can there's some very easy mistakes to make on behavioural biases, which we can help you avoid, but also get Uber confident using them to solve your challenges. So it's all based like Rebecca said, in context, by context is absolutely key to Pedro. sciences absolutely key to Fe and he. So for that reason, we've only got 25 spots on the day available, because we really want to guarantee the quality of the learning, but also because it's online. They're brilliant sessions because they bring people from all around the country. So you get this unique opportunity to network with people tackling the same issues as you as well. And then on top of that, because it is a bootcamp day, you get access to all of the behavioural science training, all of the videos and all of the master classes, as well.
Rebecca Roberts 30:31
And we're encouraging you to bring a problem, aren't we? So like, bring a real life challenge or some things you're working on to kind of tackle on the days? It's a real practical kind of opportunity as well. Yes,
Ruth Dale 30:42
absolutely. Yeah, totally encourage everyone to bring their challenge their work challenge, you don't need to know in detail. You don't have to have the answer. The whole idea is that you spend the day and you'll use behavioural science to get the answer. So in the morning, we are very much about diagnosis and empathising, so you'll do some empathy mapping in the afternoon, that's when we move to design and content. So you just need to know your challenge. You don't have to have the answers or too much information at that point, because sometimes it's quite good to be quite open, and allow you to be creative. Yeah. So is there anything else we need to tell them? Do you think Rebecca? No, I just,
Rebecca Roberts 31:20
I just think I wish this had been around when I was in higher ed. And it's really useful, because I think that behavioural science approach will just really equip you, you'll feel that you'll just feel like you've got that grounding to kind of throw at any campaign or any challenge you've got. And we know they do keep coming in higher ed and further ed. So yeah, I think that'd be a really great one. Yeah. And,
Ruth Dale 31:41
well, in true training style, we've got an early bird For bookings. So if you book before January, the 12th, which is the second Friday, you get the early bird. Now, just to say that that is for teams as well. So if you've got a larger team than six, please actually just email us and we'll have a chat with you because you probably be better suited to a team training. And we've only got five spots up until the end of March for the team trainings. So that's Rebecca and I coming together, we will run a bespoke boot camp for your team. And we will do a lot of work upfront to get to know your challenge and bring a bit more depth to those days. So if your team has more than six, yeah, let's chat and we'll probably do a bespoke but for those that we've only got five spots at the moment. Okay. So if you want to know more, please go to www dot behaviour change dot marketing forward slash F E, H E. So that's WWW dot a behaviour change dot marketing forward slash F e h e. It's a tongue twister. Oh, but I'm so excited. And thank you so much as I'm loving working with you, Rebecca. So, yeah, I'm really excited about the sessions.
Rebecca Roberts 32:52
Yeah, you too. I think we've got like a really great day planned. I can't wait to share some of the insights and new research around younger generations that I think be really helpful to coupled with your behavioural science stuff. It's gonna be great. Yeah, it's gonna
Rebecca Roberts 33:09
has helped me I'll see you soon.
Ruth Dale 33:16
Thank you so much for listening. We're super delighted to be joined us and if you've got any value out of this at all, or even if you just simply had a little chuckle. Please do share it with anyone you think it may benefit
